Resurfacing and Automotive Work for a New Shop

magneticanomaly · Dec 13, 2022

Your business prospects are only about 5% determined by your equipment, 95% by your skills.
I have a daughterwho graduated near top of class from big engineering school who dioes not know how to change oil or the difference between a bolt and a screw.
Your old manual machines will not be competitive for production. But there is money to be made in repairs, replacing unobtainable parts..but it is about your knowledge, not your tools.
A 10,000 gallon standpipe fell over in a flood here, and a 4" pipe pulled out of the threaded port near the bottom. They set it back up, but new nipple would not screw in. What does a 4" NPT tap cost, and how long a wrench does it take to turn it?
I fixed it with a hand chaser I made from an old screwdriver, a steel scale, and Mark I eyeballs.

john.k · Dec 13, 2022

Thats where the work is for old machines .....factory repair and maintenance......unfortunately its often in stinky horrible locations ,like dog food factories ,or even stinky locations in human food factories.....but you charge for that....One of my old time competitors has now specialized in sewage machinery maintenace.......nonclogging pumps,macerators ,trash screens,pond stirrers,grit handling,rotary screening ....its a nasty job ,and oddly enough you always smell of the scent used in soap ,not t**rds as you might imagine.

Garwood · Dec 13, 2022

I don't think it's cut and dried like "it's all skill" or "you can't make a dime with old manual junk".

You can have OK equipment and minimal skill and get by. There's a stupid number of shops that operate this way.

You can have junk for machines and lots of skill and do pretty well on the right jobs.

But there is some advantage to having an assortment of nice machines, lots of tooling and the skills to use it effectively.

There's a lot of work out there for crafty folks with good equipment.

john.k · Dec 13, 2022

Every kid wants to work on expensive foreign cars and make them go 1200hp....Some interesting stuff on fbook about guys buying cheapo "unfixable " sports cars ,and do ing high end repairs like numerous bottles of "Leak-Fix"......one segment ,guy takes car to a proper workshop,mechanic has head and says "Gasket has failed because head facing job was not up to spec......visible cutter grooves are a fail"

William Payne · Dec 18, 2022

john.k said:
Every kid wants to work on expensive foreign cars and make them go 1200hp....Some interesting stuff on fbook about guys buying cheapo "unfixable " sports cars ,and do ing high end repairs like numerous bottles of "Leak-Fix"......one segment ,guy takes car to a proper workshop,mechanic has head and says "Gasket has failed because head facing job was not up to spec......visible cutter grooves are a fail"

This is where the rise of the hobbyist and maker community hits the wall. They often aren't wanting to, willing to, or able to do things properly and won't listen to people who are trying to teach them how to do things to proper standards and tolerances.

I see it in every single type of industry that has a "Hobbyist" community.

William Payne · Dec 18, 2022

WakelessFoil said:
You can see the pictures on this website.

LINK: https://www.capitolmachineshop.com/gallery

There is damage to some of the parts in those pictures that is not acceptable for professional work. Either that or what's shown is not new parts.

Ox · Dec 19, 2022

William Payne said:
There is damage to some of the parts in those pictures that is not acceptable for professional work. Either that or what's shown is not new parts.

Oh boy - those doo look tough! :eek:

I wonder why they put those on their site?

------------------

Think Snow Eh!
Ox

WakelessFoil · Dec 19, 2022

William Payne said:
There is damage to some of the parts in those pictures that is not acceptable for professional work. Either that or what's shown is not new parts.

If what you are referring to is those small round aluminum cylinders, those where merely some initial test pieces. Chuck pressure was too high and not distributed enough. It was work we did for a friend and he said he didn't care about the marks. He was happy and took them anyway.

Ox · Dec 19, 2022

Those pics Shirley hurt more than help.
I'd take'm down!

---------------

Think Snow Eh!
Ox

WakelessFoil · Dec 19, 2022

William Payne said:
This is where the rise of the hobbyist and maker community hits the wall. They often aren't wanting to, willing to, or able to do things properly and won't listen to people who are trying to teach them how to do things to proper standards and tolerances.

I see it in every single type of industry that has a "Hobbyist" community.

While I agree there is plenty of ignorance in the hobbyist community, I will add that it isn't easy to learn from the professionals unless you are working for them. There is little incentive for machine shops to train those not on their pay roll, and there is little incentive for young guys to get into the trade. That is where this forum and ones alike become essential tools for learning, although the content on here can be equally educational and discouraging.

standardparts · Dec 19, 2022

WakelessFoil said:
While I agree there is plenty of ignorance in the hobbyist community, I will add that it isn't easy to learn from the professionals unless you are working for them. There is little incentive for machine shops to train those not on their pay roll, and there is little incentive for young guys to get into the trade. That is where this forum and ones alike become essential tools for learning, although the content on here can be equally educational and discouraging.

"educational and discouraging"
The website presents a really crappy image.
Education costs money, so does being in business.
Unless your living on an inheritance, have a rich partner, or win the lottery, unless you make money to pay bills it's lights out and "yelp" and others will placard the site "permanently closed".
Consider by posting a link to that site on PM how many hits you created and ask yourself what image was presented?

WakelessFoil · Dec 19, 2022

standardparts said:
"educational and discouraging"
The website presents a really crappy image.
Education costs money, so does being in business.
Unless your living on an inheritance, have a rich partner, or win the lottery, unless you make money to pay bills it's lights out and "yelp" and others will placard the site "permanently closed".
Consider by posting a link to that site on PM how many hits you created and ask yourself what image was presented?

I'm not sure I follow. But at the end of the day the customer was satisfied even before I offered to fix and replace. Anyways I scraped the image from the gallery of other projects.

standardparts · Dec 19, 2022

WakelessFoil said:
I'm not sure I follow. But at the end of the day the customer was satisfied even before I offered to fix and replace. Anyways I scraped the image from the gallery of other projects.

Suggestion...and it's way off topic (sort of) from your original question....

Spend some time reading about what others have, or are experiencing in the machine shop business....some really epic "my shop" threads.....

Member and Shop Photos

Post photos of you and your shop, so others can put face with name !

www.practicalmachinist.com

john.k · Dec 19, 2022

The Vietnamese next to my yard honed the cylinders of a Volvo 10l truck with a wood fence post and cheap flea market sandpaper..............buuut ,it gets stranger ......the truck had already been to Volvo Trucks factory workshop for overheating issue ,Volvo "we cant get the injectors out,so we take the head off ".............anyhoo,Viets run out of dollars,truck back in pieces.....Yes,the motor is put back together,and still overheats........I just happen to be in their yard and engine is running with cab up ........I just happen to notice rubber fan hub is squeeking......rubber insert is slipping......that is why the engine is overheating!

jccaclimber · Dec 20, 2022

WakelessFoil said:
I'm not sure I follow. But at the end of the day the customer was satisfied even before I offered to fix and replace. Anyways I scraped the image from the gallery of other projects.

You’re missing the point, it doesn’t matter if the customer was so happy that they gave you a tip. What matters is what someone who doesn’t know the back story will think as a first impression. If that turns them off they aren’t going to look for an explanation.
Parts with obvious defects is a bit like taking the picture for your online dating profile in the middle of a bad cold and right after finals. It might not be the best first impression.

memphisjed · Dec 20, 2022

Web site critique or bizzness stuff? The first:
Cosplay steampunk portrait I am cool with- if the gloves matched glasses. Mechanix gloves do not mix with brazing/gas welding goggles.
You have a lot of space.
What is the picture of computer screens showing me? A (poor) nest for a cutting-out-machine, a part with pockets, a new video game?
A dos screen? Great, wonderful, you are keeping electrical trash out of landfills- or are you selling keeping dos machines going without retrofit- or idk.
The mills scream front and center with fancy clamps, portrait shot, and headlining shop from first picture; yet not a single milled part in gallery.
Big credit for not using stock photos, photos completely irrelevant to shop or people.
Make some pretty shiny parts- weld them together for yard art afterwards if you want. Use those for your gallery, cycle them out as you make better real parts.

I will leave rose critique with fciron, award winning blacksmith.

If you want to do car engines, the shop that does accord and camery engines will always have a bigger customer base.

WakelessFoil · Dec 20, 2022

memphisjed said:
Cosplay steampunk portrait I am cool with- if the gloves matched glasses. Mechanix gloves do not mix with brazing/gas welding goggles.

Ha. Yeah I have gotten this before. I was watching someone weld and setting up machine.

I am set to collect more photos of the jobs we have worked on so far. The website was created in a bit of a rush with not much material to work with.

I am not sure what you mean by DOS screen? We only have one computer in the shop and it runs Windows 10.

memphisjed · Dec 20, 2022

Parts, pictures - no excuses. They can be fuzzy dirt covered lens shots and be legit. You. Posed. For. Picture... just keep the costume coherent and the venomous teeth marks off the product. The Internet has children viewing it.
Windows 10 new dark mode is black screen with faded orange fuzzy font? Machine retro theme setting?

You have a lot, a big metric lotte, of cool machines, why are you showing us a picture of a computer screen from any era? Show me what you are wanting to sell- which is the ability to run those MACHINES making PARTS.

WakelessFoil · Dec 21, 2022

memphisjed said:
why are you showing us a picture of a computer screen from any era?

Those screens are CNC controls. I will try to find some more pictures of the parts that came from those machines.

William Payne · Dec 27, 2022

Having 100 machines means nothing if you don’t know how to use them to the fullest of their capabilities.

A low skilled guy with many machines is going to be stomped by a highly skilled guy with very few.

You posted a thread where a customer came in and you accepted a job removing a broken stud of bolt from a cast iron manifold. That is a very basic job the only complicated part being knowing how to fixture the part at the right angle. The act of physically drilling out the stud is the east part.

The part that doesn’t work is you accepted the job then came on here asking how to do it. That’s not how you get into business.

Would you hire an electrician to do some wiring if they had to go online to find out which wire was the earth wire?

It’s more respectable to just admit you don’t know how to do something and not accept that job. Or accept it but disclose your inexperience to the customer.

Knowing what the quality expectations are are very important.

Fake it until you make it doesn’t really work in the trades.

Resurfacing and Automotive Work for a New Shop

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