Is alcohol the answer? ( a good read)

jim rozen

Diamond

Joined

Feb 26, 2004

Location

peekskill, NY

• Aug 4, 2022

• #41

The fungus thing in Danvers MA is widely debated. There's good reason to believe it never happened that way.

Problem with EtOh as a fuel, it's negative energy. It costs more in energy to grow the corn and distill it into ethanol than the ethanol provides in energy, when its combusted. ConAgra and Monsanto love the idea of selling corn as fuel. But it doesn't work energy-wise.

 

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Plane Parts

Aluminum

Joined

Apr 21, 2019

• Aug 4, 2022

• #42

Old thread but...

A government caused problem does not require a government "solution." Ethanol is corporate welfare plain and simple. If there was a market for food based ethanol, the market would provide it. ADM and Monsanto are making billions on corporate welfare via ethanol mandates.

Second. "In light of these realities, current U.S. energy policy is a scandal."

When 81 million voters put a guy who promised to end domestic oil production, gropes children on video, and sold his VP position to our enemies using his crack addled son as the bagman, it is no wonder we are in such a dire straight when it comes to oil. The Gulf states are laughing at us.

 

jim rozen

Diamond

Joined

Feb 26, 2004

Location

peekskill, NY

• Aug 4, 2022

• #43

Ergotism is still not a settled issue in the Danvers events:

Ergotism - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

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Bill D

Diamond

Joined

Apr 1, 2004

Location

Modesto, CA USA

• Aug 5, 2022

• #44

To preserve the food value in grain Early American citizens distilled it into wiskey which did not rot or go stale. It has quite few calories per ounce and no Ergot.
Then the wisky rebellion came up over having to pay alchol taxes. G. Washington had to come out of retirement and raise a federal army to enforce tax collecting.
Bill D

 

jim rozen

Diamond

Joined

Feb 26, 2004

Location

peekskill, NY

• Aug 5, 2022

• #45

Similar effect with apples - most were pressed into cider, which could be converted, in the winter, to applejack.

 

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Bill D

Diamond

Joined

Apr 1, 2004

Location

Modesto, CA USA

• Aug 5, 2022

• #46

It was not until 1869 that grape juice could be pasturized and drunk more then. a day or two after harvest. Thanks Mr. Welch.

Johnny appleseed was not well regarded in his time. He got seeds from cider mills of unknown type and grew them into seedlings that he sold for settlers to make hard cider. The apple varites he was selling were pretty much inedible until fermented. Growing apple trees on your homested was a sign that you like alcohol not you liked healthy fruit.
Bill D

 

jscpm

Titanium

Joined

May 4, 2010

Location

Cambridge, MA

• Aug 8, 2022

• #47

When the Nazis ran out of oil, they tried to run their war machine on alcohol and we all know how that worked out.

The USA has huge amounts of untapped oil reserves. In the unlikely scenario that we needed oil, we could just open up those unused wells. Just in LA alone there are probably billions of untapped barrels sitting there unused because of a few environmental freaks in Santa Monica.

 

jim rozen

Diamond

Joined

Feb 26, 2004

Location

peekskill, NY

• Aug 8, 2022

• #48

Says the man who lives next to harvard and MIT, and near one of the large corporate environmental disasters, in Woburn. Your distaste for envinmental freaks would be a lot more impressive if you lived in Hanford.

 

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Garwood

Diamond

Joined

Oct 10, 2009

Location

Oregon

• Aug 14, 2022

• #49

jscpm said:

When the Nazis ran out of oil, they tried to run their war machine on alcohol and we all know how that worked out.

Click to expand...

I have always read that Nazi fuel was mostly gasoline synthesized from coal using the Bergius process. There's mention of them using methanol from coal, but not in any significant amount.

 

J

john.k

Diamond

Joined

Dec 21, 2012

Location

Brisbane Qld Australia

• Aug 15, 2022

• #50

I think its actually the Russian war machine that runs on alcohol.....cheap vodka.

 

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Gearclash

Aluminum

Joined

Feb 1, 2017

• Aug 28, 2022

• #51

john.k said:

All the comment about methanol.....no methanol in gasoline here,its all ethanol......hence E85 etc............its also supposed to be the corn lobby in some US states ,far as I know corn makes ethanol.

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You would be correct. Here in this United States, roughly 40% of the corn crop goes through an ethanol plant. The result is go juice for your gas guzzlers and a feed for the animal industry that fits well with their metabolic needs. Distillers grains are high in protein as the ethanol production process remove mainly starch. As a whole, the most economically grown feedstuffs in the US are long on starch and short on protein.

Ran the numbers once. If 100% of the US grown corn went through an ethanol plant (not feasible), enough ethanol would be produced to make nationwide E30 possible. One thing that is pretty non debatable, ethanol is a far safer additive than MTBE.

 

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SteveF

Titanium

Joined

Jul 4, 2004

Location

central NC

• Sep 26, 2022

• #52

Reading through the first post I’d just like to point out the Exxon Valdez point really isn’t a good one. If the captain wasn’t running on ethanol there would have been NO environmental impact.