BIAX Scraper Green motor replacement found

Richard King · Aug 5, 2021

Hello, A month or so ago, I wrote about the Green Metabo motor that BIAX used on the Biax scraper models back in the 1970's and 80's were discontinued and no repair parts were being sold again. I had a Russian Member of my Facebook page who has solved the problem. He talks about a pneumatic scraper, but the head is the same head as on the electric motor models. It is variable speed too. I checked on Amazon and a grinder complete, new was around $150.00. Here is what he wrote.

hello, I bought a pneumatic Biax, and decided to convert it to an electric one, for this I took an electrical part from a Bosch straight grinder, the first version came out very heavy and large, the length of the Biax is 530mm and the weight is 5300 grams, then I decided that it was necessary to redo it, in the final version the weight of the Biax was 4400 grams , and the length is 420mm, below in the comments.

The motor model of the Bosch GGS 27 grinder, I tried to scrape at low and medium speeds, I did not notice any lack of power.

He posted a video on my site, but I'm not sure how to transfer it here.

Will try to show photo's:

Richard King · Aug 5, 2021

I also see on Amazon another motor on a grinder that looks like it may work. I plan on ordering it and seeing if I can convert it too. It's a VS Metabo HPT Angle Grinder selling for $170.00. There has to be thousands of those old green models out there that we can save. Biax told me the new motors they sell on the new $4000.00 machines won't fit the old models. Rich

ballen · Aug 5, 2021

Hi Rich,

There is a Metabo jig-saw, model ST-EP 564, whose motor/switch/speed control assembly is an identical drop-in replacement for the Biax. The only thing that's different is the name sticker. They turn up regularly on German Ebay, you can get a shiny used one for 100 Euros and a beater for 30 or 40. Here are links to a couple of them:

Metabo ST EP 564 Stichsage Sage in Rheinland-Pfalz - Herforst | eBay Kleinanzeigen

Pendelhubstichsage Metabo St EP 564 550 Watt in Rheinland-Pfalz - Berschweiler | eBay Kleinanzeigen

These are 230VAC models, but I imagine that they also made a 120V version. Can someone else here provide the exact model number for that one?

Cheers,
Bruce

Richard King · Aug 5, 2021

Bruce, We had a Brazilian and American member of the facebook group mentioned this a few months ago when we started to play detective on this and a couple of us tried to find that saw over here. I even called Metabo USA and they said that saw motor is not made or parts supplied over here any more. I checked back on ebay sold archive and found one. So that isn't an option over here or down in Brazil. He had converted his scraper with a used one, but used ones are not sold to often. I figure if someone has one, they use it and toss it when it wears out. The saw probably cost around $100.00. Biax told me the reason the scrapers cost so much, it's not the motors, it's the scraper mechanisms. Biax makes make 1000 scrapers a year and those saws Metabo made millions.

Here is where Biax makes their $$ https://youtu.be/JxJw-sLJh90

EFA Germany - The full range of machines for every slaughter plant and industrial meat processing factory. - Company - Portrait

CBlair · Aug 5, 2021

Richard I copied your post and made a sticky for it at the top of the page.

Charles

Nickki · Aug 6, 2021

Richard King said:
I also see on Amazon another motor on a grinder that looks like it may work. I plan on ordering it and seeing if I can convert it too. It's a VS Metabo HPT Angle Grinder selling for $170.00. There has to be thousands of those old green models out there that we can save. Biax told me the new motors they sell on the new $4000.00 machines won't fit the old models. Rich

I have a question all the time. Why can't I put a power tool speed controller on an old Biax model? I think this will work well.
for example like this: 1PC Angle Grinder Polishing Machine Speed Controller Switch Electric Power Tools | eBay
Now you can 3D print the regulator body to neatly attach the regulator to the motor.

CharlyDE · Aug 27, 2021

Richard King said:
The motor model of the Bosch GGS 27 grinder, I tried to scrape at low and medium speeds, I did not notice any lack of power.

Click to expand...

He posted a video on my site, but I'm not sure how to transfer it here.

I didn't find the facebook post related to this thread.

The 1st photograph shows, that he made one stage of the gearbox by himself.
The 2nd photograph shows the Bosch part number 0 601 210 703. That's an european 230-V-version of a Bosch GGS 27 C.
The armature (same for 220 V and 230 V versions) inside has the part number 2 604 010 769 (photograph on ebay) and is used in the machines:
- GGS 27 C (Straight Grinder)
- POF 600 ACE (Router)
- FBZ 40-30 (Cutting Drill Center)
- GKF 600 CE (Trimmer)

The end of that armature has no gear; it's a collet chuck. Which gear did he use und how the gear has been fastened onto the armature?

Cheers,
Karl

M.B. Naegle · Aug 27, 2021

Nickki said:
I have a question all the time. Why can't I put a power tool speed controller on an old Biax model? I think this will work well.
for example like this: 1PC Angle Grinder Polishing Machine Speed Controller Switch Electric Power Tools | eBay
Now you can 3D print the regulator body to neatly attach the regulator to the motor.

I'm not sure about the switch you linked, but I use a Variac transformer on my old blue Biax. Mine's a much older version of this:Bench Top 20 Amp Variac Variable Auto-Transformer with LCD Digital Display

It vary's the voltage of brushed AC motors to vary the speed. I don't see that little switch having the same effect.

Richard King · Aug 27, 2021

The facebook info is inside my Private Forum. King-Way Scraping Consultants. Join it and find out how and why. He just showed an old 1//2 moon flaker too.

TGTool · Aug 27, 2021

M.B. Naegle said:
I'm not sure about the switch you linked, but I use a Variac transformer on my old blue Biax. Mine's a much older version of this:Bench Top 20 Amp Variac Variable Auto-Transformer with LCD Digital Display

It vary's the voltage of brushed AC motors to vary the speed. I don't see that little switch having the same effect.

Just a guess, but the little switch speed control is likely a PWM module, or it controls one. It should present a torque advantage over a variac at lower speeds. If your setup works fine, there's nor reason to fret over alternatives.

Peter. · Sep 4, 2021

I fitted a PWM grinder speed control to my blue Biax and it works great.

Also I have this evening removed the original 110v motor from my green BIAX and replaced it complete with a 240v motor from a Metabo Jigsaw. I can confirm that the motor is a direct swap with no issues whatsoever. The donor jigsaw is Metabo STEP 700 Quick.

ballen · Sep 6, 2021

Peter. said:
I have this evening removed the original 110v motor from my green BIAX and replaced it complete with a 240v motor from a Metabo Jigsaw. I can confirm that the motor is a direct swap with no issues whatsoever. The donor jigsaw is Metabo STEP 700 Quick.

That's good news, as it means that both the Metabo ST EP 564 and ST EP 700 Quick have compatible motors.

Peter. · Sep 6, 2021

ballen said:
That's good news, as it means that both the Metabo ST EP 564 and ST EP 700 Quick have compatible motors.

Yes and all of the motor internals from the STEP 565 will swap over but being top-handled the speed control will not.

stephen thomas · Dec 5, 2022

My photo editor or computer is fighting me and i cannot post an actual picture of my Biax EB/4 but it looks a good bit like the one second from left in the picture i lifted from an old post on Coburns by another PM'r.

I've had/used/abused it for a couple decades and it is time to tighten it up. The plastic motor case was cracked when acquired, now it is loose enough that it interferes with the motor operation when it flexes.

My question is, how is it fastened to the metal case front end?
I can see screws (3?) but how to access them? I took the plastic end off, and apparently you have to work from the other/gearcase end?
Where is the starting point - what do you take off or open first? (So as to get in to remove the plastic motor case to repair it, and then secure it back on.)

Thanks!
smt

Richard King · Dec 5, 2022

It's been a while sense I worked on one. I think there are 3 hex nuts holding the top area on. one has a strap holder connector under it. You then sort of tip the top cowling down to unhook the blade stoke shaft and remove it then where it had rested or was attached you will see 2 cap screws that hold on the plastic motor case. They are approx 2" long. Once it's off, remove the carbon brushes and snap back their springs.. It will make more sense as your doing it. Be carful removing the armature as the plastic fan can easily crack when pried on. You may have to remove the blade holder too. You can also get advice from Ed Dyjak who is the only one left of the DAPRA / Biax repair station outside of DAPRA. He may also have some used cowlings for sale. He had a huge collection of used parts a few years ago. (248) 684-4260 I wish I had one of those power scrapers on the far right of the picture

Directions

3801 Stobart Rd, Milford, MI 48380
248) 684-4260

Peter. · Dec 5, 2022

I have one of these apart on my desk right now doing a vari-speed conversion.
First, set the stroke to near maximum, it'll help you when you put it back together and you won't have to remove the blade carrier.
Undo the three nuts holding the front housing on and pull it off to the front, carefully nodding it down to un-hook the drive pin
Remove the wobble drive by un-screwing it. Can be a stinker to get off. I stick a close-fitting pin in one of the wobble drive holes and give it a sharp crack to break the thread loose then un-do it by hand. Once the wobble drive is off you can un-do the two M5 nuts that hold gearbox together. Pull off the front end of the gearbox and you'll find these three screws inside.

Remove those and you'll be able to strip the motor off. Heed Richard's warnings carefully, the fan is easily broken and the armature wires are susceptible to damage if you don't take great care.

stephen thomas · Dec 5, 2022

Gosh what a nuisance for such a simple interface!

Glad i asked, and Peter, thanks for the step by step clear description.

Tried to take pix of my actual unit again this morning, but it seems Nikon finally stopped supporting my Nikon pnoto editor, so it won't show them. They flash on the screen and disappear.
This might of might not be original motor - Richard said something about replacing it when he sold it to me back in the dark ages. That is, it is a Biax or Metabo motor, and everything gibes with Peter's description as far as attachment; just an ancient memory of Richard advising he built it up from parts at the time.

With that much consternation to take apart, it's too bad we don't have an alternate motor option like you guys in GB have for $15 replacement.

Wondering if HF has something that would work.....

Just to make this yet a bigger project

smt

Richard King · Dec 5, 2022

Talk to someone with a 3 D printer. One of my German students made a new case on his 3D printer. I have no clue on 3 D printers. I'd check with Ed Dyjak too. Rich

stephen thomas · Dec 5, 2022

That's an interesting option, Richard.
I've been having a run of luck with the local librarian on the maker space tools for patterns for woodworking inlays, Gorton Pantograph masters for logos using the library's toy router and decent laser. I know he wishes i'd come up with something a little more challenging for him to sink his teeth into. They have some sort of digitizer and at least a couple decent 3D printers.

OTOH the dar n Biax is just a tool, that i want to go in the shop, plug it into the speed control hooked to my belt, and go to work.

,

But as i say, had not thought that far ahead, and it could be a solution.

smt

Richard King · Dec 5, 2022

Maybe a question you can ask in the 3 D printer. They scan it first somehow and it prints out what they scan.

BIAX Scraper Green motor replacement found

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