SB heavy 10 Tailstock key replacement

Greenfield Guitars · Jan 5, 2023

Hi everyone!
I have a very early 1950s SB heavy 10. I am 'tightening it up' and bringing it to tolerance. As with many lathes of this age, the tailstock quill is sloppy. I cannot find any exterior hole to drive the key into the bore (and replace it). It appears to be integral with a long key set in the tailstock bore? Possible?

If this has been addressed somewhere else on the forum, sorry for the repeat. If anyone here can point me in the direction of how to affect this repair, I would be very grateful.

jim rozen · Jan 5, 2023

These usually get painted over. Look inside the key and you can probably see the top of the pin. If you measure how deep inside the bore it is, that'll give you a starting point to go hunting.

Greenfield Guitars · Jan 5, 2023

Thanx for the reply Jim!
I did look for that and did not find it - which is not to say that I didn't miss it.
I have attached a pic of the inside of the bore and the exterior of the TS. taking the location of the key into account, it would have to run all the way through the web to the bottom.
Unless....this is not original and someone, at some point, did this repair?

SLK001 · Jan 5, 2023

Your tailstock isn't original, if your lathe is from the 1950's. That type was replaced in 1945. Your TS should have the unit code of T-100 stamped on the right rear of the body casting.

If the T-100 is like its larger cousins, the pin is inserted from underneath at an angle. Look on the side with the binding lever (underneath). If you look at your first photo, you'll see that the key is offset from the web that is underneath the mouth. Look in that area.

Greenfield Guitars · Jan 6, 2023

SLK001 said:
Your tailstock isn't original, if your lathe is from the 1950's. That type was replaced in 1945. Your TS should have the unit code of T-100 stamped on the right rear of the body casting.

If the T-100 is like its larger cousins, the pin is inserted from underneath at an angle. Look on the side with the binding lever (underneath). If you look at your first photo, you'll see that the key is offset from the web that is underneath the mouth. Look in that area.

Thanx for this great information. I removed the TS from the lathe so I could examine it and provide a 'straight-on' image of the bore. The parallax made it appear the key was offset. It seems (to me) that it is centered. While the TS was off, I also found this hole just below the binding lever (image). However, it seems to be blind. There does not seem to be evidence of access to the pin and the hole also seems to be in the wrong place. There is no T-100 stamped anywhere (that I can see) on the body casting.

My career is that of a woodworker (guitarmaker). So a vintage lathe is new to me. If this was a vintage guitar....well, perhaps I would be in a position to answer the questions of others

. Not that it matters but I am curious about the year. I have also attached the serial #. If you don't ask....you won't learn anything...

kitno455 · Jan 6, 2023

Mid to late 1951, looks like the immediately succeeding serial number is already in the database: http://www.wswells.com/sn/sn_db.html

allan

Greenfield Guitars · Jan 6, 2023

kitno455 said:
Mid to late 1951, looks like the immediately succeeding serial number is already in the database: http://www.wswells.com/sn/sn_db.html

allan

As suspected. Thanx for confirming Allan. Having said that....it seems the TS is not original...so who knows what is and is not?! It doesn't really matter, as I bought the machine tool to use in my business. It is fun to know.

M.B. Naegle · Jan 6, 2023

If it's not built like the original, is worn, and there's no evidence how to get it apart, I'd carefully grind or bore the old one away and drill a new hole how other South Bends are. Either that or work with it like it is and keep an eye out for one you know is built like SB and can be rebuilt.

At least your ways look nice

.

SLK001 · Jan 6, 2023

Here's a breakdown of the larger "old style" tailstocks. I don't know just how alike the 10L version of this T-100 TS compares with the larger versions. But, at the very least, it will give you someplace to start.

Greenfield Guitars · Jan 6, 2023

SLK001 said:
Here's a breakdown of the larger "old style" tailstocks. I don't know just how alike the 10L version of this T-100 TS compares with the larger versions. But, at the very least, it will give you someplace to start.

This is terrific!
I will put on my archeologist's cap and do some excavating.
Thanx so much!

animal12 · Jan 6, 2023

Can't help ya with your tailstock , but what beautiful guitars you build . Sound & appearance !!!
I really like the chamfer on the top & the sides .
thanks
animal

Greenfield Guitars · Jan 7, 2023

animal12 said:
Can't help ya with your tailstock , but what beautiful guitars you build . Sound & appearance !!!
I really like the chamfer on the top & the sides .
thanks
animal

Animal!
Thanx for the very kind words about my work.

swells · Jan 9, 2023

The key is located in the top area of the front web at a 45-degree angle.
Grind the area shown in the photos until you can find the center then drill as shown,
then punch it out. See note B in the print. Grind the new pin to fit the spindle and 45-degree
angle before installing.
See linked photos of removed key.

http://www.wswells.com//download/tailstock/R/1.jpg

http://www.wswells.com//download/tailstock/R/2.jpg

http://www.wswells.com//download/tailstock/R/3.jpg

http://www.wswells.com//download/tailstock/R/4.jpg

http://www.wswells.com//download/tailstock/R/6.jpg

http://www.wswells.com//download/tailstock/R/7.jpg

hope this helps,
Steve

animal12 · Jan 9, 2023

Greenfield Guitars said:
Animal!
Thanx for the very kind words about my work.

Well deserved . I love a full sounded guitar , somthing that factories don't know how to do '
I accept blems as donations
animal

animal12 · Jan 9, 2023

Steve , is that common for all SB lathes or atleast the 9 A-C ?
thanks
animal

swells · Jan 10, 2023

animal12 said:
Steve , is that common for all SB lathes or atleast the 9 A-C ?
thanks
animal

Mike,
It's common on the letter series lathes and Workshop lathes that have the rib cast in the front.
If the 286 part number is listed, that is the pressed in round key. This key could be ground to a few different widths for the quill keyways. The 10K style Tailstock quill which was used on the re-designed 10L upper casting is different. It is a 285KR, a square key pinned in the quill.
Steve

animal12 · Jan 10, 2023

Thanks Steve
animal

SB heavy 10 Tailstock key replacement

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