Vogel lubrication unit Controller gone bad

Peter from Holland · Dec 19, 2022

We have a Vogel lubrication unit on one of our Deckel millling machines that the controller is bad
Replacements are expensive
As we have this problem on a regular base we look into making something of our own as a option
I see the devise doing the following
If it gets power the pump start
It the pressure switch engages the pump stops
Then a timer starts for the next cycle
I can see 2 alarms
1 When the pressure switch engages within a very short time (2sec) the line seems to be plugged That stops the pump and the alarmled lights up
2 When the pressure switch is not engaged after a longer time (2min??) the line has a leak Pump stops and the alarmled lights up
Then there is also a pressbutton for manual lubrication
Am I missing something ??
Does there exist something already for about €350,-?? (240v 50Hz)

Peter

jz79 · Dec 19, 2022

Wouldn't one of those small DIN rail mounted PLCs suffice for something that simple? I can't say which one would work for this, since I never programmed one of those in my life, but I figure they should have timers in them to handle your 1. and 2. alarm conditions. They aren't exactly cheap, but I think you'd be able to put together everything necessary with your budget.

Something custom, analog or digital, could be made much cheaper, but for low quantity it doesn't make sense unless you can do the circuit design yourself.

maybe something like this https://www.amazon.nl/-/en/SR2B121FU/dp/B00205B5QG/

AlfaGTA · Dec 19, 2022

Peter from Holland said:
Am I missing something ??

Peter

Well if you want to replicate the Deckel arrangement, then you have to inhibit the timer when the machine is running under program and feeding, then allow when executing a rapid.....Think they were concerned with "floating" the slides and affecting the tool position.
Cheers Ross

Peter from Holland · Dec 19, 2022

This one is for a Deckel FP4MK and is a standalone unit Only 220V input No output
So no rapids correction

Peter

rimcanyon · Dec 19, 2022

I think you need a timer inhibit capability and a way to tell the pump to pump now (electrical signal). I.e. the timer should not advance unless the slides are moving, and as Ross says, the pump should not pump except when told to if the machine is under program control, so timer could be inhibited in that case also. It also needs to pump when told to do so my pressing the lube button on the control, or when the control tells it to. It doesn’t make a lot of sense to design the system for a non-CNC machine, since the CNC solution would work for both.

Peter from Holland · Dec 20, 2022

rimcanyon said:
I think you need a timer inhibit capability and a way to tell the pump to pump now (electrical signal). I.e. the timer should not advance unless the slides are moving, and as Ross says, the pump should not pump except when told to if the machine is under program control, so timer could be inhibited in that case also. It also needs to pump when told to do so my pressing the lube button on the control, or when the control tells it to. It doesn’t make a lot of sense to design the system for a non-CNC machine, since the CNC solution would work for both.

Like I said This is a standalone unit on a conventional machine Just power comming in to the Vogel unit
No way it can know if powerfeed is engaged or not
To me it is a timer to start the pump for the time between cycles A pressure switch to stop the pump
and then those 2 alarms and manual pushbutton like in my previous post
It is not a CNC
The same unit as on the active FP1-2 and 3

Peter

DeadMahoDude · Dec 20, 2022

Typical NE555 task, with SCR on output.
Should be possible for like $20 on breadboard. lots of reference circuits out there, where you only calculate and put the right components into:

ne555 pulse generator - Google Search

https://www.electroschematics.com/pulse-generator-with-555/

If you don't like building yourself, post a pic of the controller, maybe I can try fix it, for a little cash?

Peter from Holland · Dec 21, 2022

DeadMahoDude said:
Typical NE555 task, with SCR on output.
Should be possible for like $20 on breadboard. lots of reference circuits out there, where you only calculate and put the right components into:

ne555 pulse generator - Google Search

https://www.electroschematics.com/pulse-generator-with-555/

If you don't like building yourself, post a pic of the controller, maybe I can try fix it, for a little cash?

Thanks
In the new year I post some pictures of the inside of the IG38 controler
Outside you can see here https://ersatzteilcenter.net/IG38-Zentralschmierung-Steuergeraet-230V

Peter

DeadMahoDude · Dec 21, 2022

Looks like they use some kind of line cycle counter/zero detector of rectified 100Hz.
100Hz divide by 6000 (60sek*100Hz) to get 1min pulse, then binary counter, where you select the output from, with the switch on the front.

Peter from Holland · Dec 21, 2022

It keeps pumping constantly Although the pressureswitch gets activated Both leds burn If that is of help

BillE · Dec 29, 2022

Dunno if this helps in any way, seems to show a variety of timer functions, with 2 lights being abnormal if reading that right.

Peter from Holland · Dec 29, 2022

Thank

BillE said:
Dunno if this helps in any way, seems to show a variety of timer functions, with 2 lights being abnormal if reading that right.

Thanks for the paper
I look into it

Peter

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