Fadal Evaluation Questions

Good evening,

I am hoping to lean on the forum for advice. I am the new owner of a 2000 Fadal 2216 that I purchased from who I have heard was a reputable Fadal seller in the Bay Area. When purchasing the machine, I was assured that the turcite on the machine would be in good shape and if not, that it would be corrected. I specified the tolerances that I wanted to hit (+/- 0.0005). In reality, if I could hit +/- 0.001" I would be content.

The machine was delivered in July of 2022. It took about a month to get the machine wired and get a tech out to do the initial setup. As I began familiarizing myself with the machine I swept a (stationary) indicator in the spindle across the x-axis. As I jogged the spindle from X negative to X positive the table drops about 0.011". I am thinking this is wear in the turcite. The seller thinks that the machine needs to re-leveled and that there is twist in the bed. This seems like a lot of deviation (0.011" drop in Z over the 22" x travel)? What are your thoughts?

Regardless, it has been difficult to get him scheduled to come out. He is busy which I know, but it is obvious that I am not a priority as I have called a number of times.

Finally last week, I pulled the x way covers and measured directly from the X ways to the table surface and I am seeing that the table is approximately 0.015" higher. I have some pictures below. I think this measurement is pretty definitive, and would exclude any error from potential twist. Please let me know if you disagree.

I am hesitant to push back without having other opinions on the cause of the deviation. For the same reason, I don't want to speak badly of him if I am wrong. With that said, please let me know your thoughts.

Also, if there are any recommendations for techs in the Bay Area that would service the Fairfield/Napa area, I would be interested in scheduling a visit.

Thanks and Happy Holidays.

Patrick

Also, I am trying to post pictures, however it seems they are too big. I will work to get them posted soon.

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a small 2216 if it was leveled once decent shouldn't need to be touched again for what you are trying to accomplish if you were after a couple tenths different story. not sure you are going to get the best reading off the corners of the table casting those may not be ground/machined. i'd have to take a look at my machines to confirm. usually i'd take a swipe across the table itself see what you get from there.

I agree, measure the table top. Also clean the ways. Take pictures of the base and saddle ways. If you have to make or buy a better / bigger height gage. When you take the pictures and download them put the pixel on the lowest it will go. I suspect the dealer gave you a a 30 day return privilege meaning you had 30 days to return the machine and it's written in your bill of sale or invoice.. That's what most used dealers give on used machines. Unless you have something in writing for more you are screwed. I have a friend in Berkeley who can test it and re-turcite it. From the lousy pictures you are showing either the ways are screwed up or they are filthy.

We have had a couple of Fadal owners who have repaired their own machines with our help. Show us new pictures of the ways and tests on the table top corners. Also if the table /saddle ways are bad the base / saddle ways are shot too, probably worse. Also the lube system and nylon pipes are shot. Send me a private message with your name, email, location and phone number and I'll give it to my friend.

Thanks for the replies. I have been out of town for a couple weeks for works. I actually posted the wrong pictures with the same setup but testing to a 1-2-3 block on the table. The results were the same pattern. Ducesrwld, that was my thinking as well and I appreciate the affirmation. Rich, I actually took your class in Vacaville, back in 2018. I will follow-up with an email to get your contact's information in Berkeley. Also, I will try to get some pictures of the ways later tonight.

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Where are you setting the gage base on? I can't see under there. It should be setting on the saddle top ways. What I see looks corroded and dirty?? The first photo it looks like it is next to the crusty saddle way. If the ways are that nasty they need to be ground or they will work like sand paper even on new Rulon. I emailed you my friend DH Mayeron who lives in Berkeley. If it needs to be ground these guys are good and in CA. https://schaffergrinding.com/

I am placing the gage base on the saddle ways. I think the part you may be seeing are little rough casting tabs that protrude from the table. The chip enclosure was clean, however the underside of the table was full of chips. I received your email, and I hope to back from DH Mayeron. Thanks for that. Here are some pictures of the ways.

Your farside x-axis away looks bad

Y-axis and nearside x-axis doesnt look much better.

I have a seal on the face of the y-axis covers at the interface to the saddle to stop coolant dripping down onto the ways. That's were the corrosion on the y-axis ways is coming from

also take off the lines from the metering units and make sure their metering oil. And flush the lines thru with kerosene to flush any gunk out

You might be able to check x-axis turcite. Go the extremes of the x-axis travel. If the turcite goes past the end of the ways (like it does on my 4020) you might be able to feel the turcite. It should be flat across it's width. If there's a step in the turcite in the direction of the ways, you've got wear in the turcite. Looking at the pictures, I think you need new turcite or return the machine

You are trying to get a few tenths on a half clapped out 2216?? First thing I would do is verify the table before purchase, backlash...ect. Then once you get it use the kerosene procedure to flush the oil system. The oil system alone will not bring back .015" of table droop. Only new turcite will. The edges of your saddle do not look bad you simply have wear either in turcite or turcite and saddle. It is clearly the wrong machine for what you are trying to do....however it may work for some things