Miller Welder warranty....

I just bought a used Miller 211 inverter powered Mig machine... the guy I got if from bought it new in March 2021. He has a mobile welding service and used it up to the day before I bought it off him. $1600 I paid for this... with a spool gun for aluminum. New units can be had for nearly the same amount, but the spool gun would add a few hundred dollars to that, so I took the chance on paying that for this one and got the spool gun for free and no tax, the way I looked at it.

Well, I get home with it, set it up to run on gas vs. flux core... and I make exactly two welds an inch long... and the thing stops putting out welding current. I thought it was a bad connection on the ground clamp... but it wasn't.

No arc. It has open circuit voltage, but won't strike an arc.

I call the number on the inside of the machine and tell the person answering what it's doing. He suggests I take it to a Miller service place close to me.

I do. Day or two later the service guy calls and says that it's either the PC control board has went bad, or the "wind tunnel where all the magic happens". Says the PC board is over $500 to replace, and the thing he called the wind tunnel is $1300, and asks me if I want to repair it or stop where he's at and call it a wash.

Call it a wash...

I contact the seller and tell him angrily that he fucked me... he patiently explains that he didn't fuck me... he'd used it the day before. He explains that he bought it new and the only trouble he'd had with it was that the pushbutton circuit breaker went bad at one time, and the shop where he bought it at fixed that, but other than that, he had no trouble with it.. and sends me a picture of the receipt where he'd purchased it new.. dated March 2021.

I calm down... he says "those things have a 3 year warranty. My blood pressure goes down.....
I call the service center back and say "hey, that thing was bought new in 2021... it's still under warranty.
Service center guys says "well...by the serial number of that thing... it's a 2017 built machine...and the warranty is expired. Warranty doesn't start on the day of purchase, but the date of manufacture. If it sits on the floor at the Miller distributor's store for 2 or 3 years... the warranty clock is ticking."

I thank him for his time and hang up.

I can't believe that this is true.... what a piss poor warranty.

In frustration, I joined a Miller sponsored website (forum/millerwelds.com) that has discussion groups just like ours here... I was going to find out who to contact to raise hell... but, after registering 3 days ago, the admin there has yet to admit me with posting ability.... so I can't get anywhere there.

The most expensive Harbor Freight unit is $900... a 2 year warranty is $230 for that.. I'm not using it in a production atmosphere... and if the Mig guns happen to be interchangeable in size.. I'd just about buy one of those.

Signed, Frustrated in Kansas.

Edit: I read a lot on the Miller forum, and this doesn't seem to be an isolated incident. Other owners spoke of welding along and there'd be a loud "POP" and their machine would quit working... and it turned out usually to be the circuit board. But, most of them.. their machines would quit feeding wire, no fan...no nothing. This one here... it feeds wire, the fan runs... sounds just right.. but no arc.

Yup, and the Miller forums cracked down hard years ago with communistic mods....this action spawned a few independent forums.

My Miller Synchrowave 180 tig did something pretty similar several years ago and all I needed to do was retorque the studs that hold the cables that feed the welding cables. Hopefully you will be so lucky.

I sorta hate to be a HF fanboy, but I'm a practical machinist....and practical welder. After reading your first 3 paragraphs, I thought to myself 'coulda-shoulda bought a HF unit with their spool gun, and it would have the warranty'. Plus if it croaks after the warranty period, you could throw it out, buy another, and really not be out much. I've had my Titanium 200 for 3 years now, and have used it quite a bit. Never have had it f-up or overheat-shutdown yet. The weld quality impresses me everytime I use it. Buy USA is great, when there's something to gain from that. Other than paying more money for it.

DDoug said:

Yup, and the Miller forums cracked down hard years ago with communistic mods....this action spawned a few independent forums.

Click to expand...

Can you direct me to one of them? I would like to find out if what this place is telling me about the warranty starting from date of manufacture is right or not.

I have only one piece of advice because my miller was brought used and well out of any kind of warranty. Go back to miller corporate and see what they say. Seems like a ridiculous warranty to me.

Miller welders are fantastic I would happily only use miller, hopefully you can get this sorted out.

William Payne said:

https://www.millerwelds.com/-/media/miller-electric/files/pdf/warranty/warranty.pdf?la=en

Click to expand...

Wow, True Blue and Screw You.......Won't ever be one in my shop.

dkmc said:

Wow, True Blue and Screw You.......Won't ever be one in my shop.

Click to expand...

Things happen, I am very much of the opinion of express your dissatisfaction and allowing the company to have the option to make it right before making a decision like that. My recommendation for the original poster would be to contact miller and explain the situation including the date of purchase.

If miller won't help than well bugga. It is very much buyer beware on used goods. But unless its been run really hard that is way to soon to be dying.

However talking to guys who own inverter dynasty machines they say that with the inverter machines irrelevant of brand you get so many hours and then they pop.

The cost to the original poster is that they will want to just swap the board rather than doing a component level repair on the board. Circuit board repair is an art to itself.

So, basically, this 2017 Miller 211 had burnt up 4 of the 5 years of warranty before it was sold, and when the 1 year anniversary of that came around... it was out of warranty... and I buy it 7 months later.... what a crock of shit.

I have had really good success with companies on various issues by finding random wording in their legal mumbo jumbo that works in your favour. I would be very interested in using the wording just before what you have highlighted.

I just read your original post again, I notice you said you could have brought a new machine for the same price. With inverters that is usually the better option.

I don't have any inverter machines, I have a 400amp synchrowave and when I brought a water cooler for it I planned on buying a refurbished one thinking it would be cheaper. I rang up my miller dealer just because I wanted to know what the new price would be. It wound up cheaper for me to buy a brand new one.

I serialize products on the way out. I add a year to the warrantee for shelf time. On top of that I try to be flexible. Tell me a story. After that I will send you whatever you need, usually gratis. Granted I sell much much cheaper stuff, but what kind of crap do you have to ship to have a warrantee policy like that?

This is the problem with inverter welders, lots of electric components that can catastrophically fail leaving the whole machine a paperweight.
Sure they are only 40 lbs now compared to 85 with the older transformer version(which i have and bought new in 2010)
Where the older ones had less to break and less chances of it blowing up transistors inside.
Have had a tig welder of a “neverlast” brand blow up and take out the whole board in a shower of sparks. It happens, and never if, but only a when.

I read that earlier.. .and thought "yeah, I've got them there in that first highlighted portion... but then I re-read it and got to the last sentence.
Bastards!!!!

Aside from the warratee issues, which I agree you’re getting screwed. Based on all my reading and experience, never buy a used inverter welder unless is a super bargain. And I mean like a 1/4 of new price or there about.

Also, I just recently sold a 252 and bought a new 211 (new). Mostly to get something more portable. I also have a miller cv power supply/feeder. Hope the 211 holds up.

Quote from the original post:

" No arc. It has open circuit voltage, but won't strike an arc."

If the H bridge or its driver circuit had failed on the inverter there would be no open circuit voltage. The 20KHz 300 volt square wave generated from the H bridge is connected to a transformer which steps the voltage down to 40 volts with a corresponding increase in current. The square wave is then sent off to the rectifier and filter circuit to produce the DC open circuit voltage. The regulating circuit controls the duty cycle of the inverter H bridge to match the weld voltage set point , regulate the voltage/amps slope and maybe the variable inductance after the DC filter circuit.

If you have measured 40 volts open circuit on the welder positive terminal with respect to ground the inverter is working. Your problem is a bad power cable connecting the spool gun to the inverter.
This can be verified by connecting a dummy load such as a carbon gouging electrode or a long loop of steel wire between the ground and the positive terminals of the inverter.

This wasn't with the spool gun, this was with the regular gun..

I can't remember exactly what the technician told me over the phone that he discovered when he was diagnosing the machine but it seems like it was about the lack of output from some certain points on the board.

Your state's consumer protection laws will override whatever Miller wants you to believe. Do go through and read them 1st to make sure there's not a clause preventing the warranty period clock running before purchase.

Also I don't know this repair center and I'm not accusing them of this, but my buddy was authorized Miller repair center for years and I know Miller doesn't pay those guys s*** for these repairs. I wouldn't be surprised if there's some less than honest repair centers out there that try to get people to pay for it outside of what miller's going to cover on a warranty job. ( It's the only way they'd make money honestly, because like I said Miller doesn't pay them s*** for this work)

Edit to add from the bottom of the miller warranty card:

"Some US states do not allow limiting the duration of an implied warranty or the exclusion of certain damages, so the above limitations may not apply to you. This warranty provides specific legal rights, and other rights may be available depending on your state. In Canada, some provinces provide additional warranties or remedies, and to the extent the law prohibits their waiver, the limitations set out above may not apply. This Limited Warranty provides specific legal rights, and other rights may be available, but may vary by province."

Yeah you really need to take this up with Miller based on the consumer rights laws where you live.

My big thing with any company is things happen but give them the change to make it right.